Question about the Great Hunt

[ogierbear]

I just recently joined your website and am fairly new to "The Wheel of Time."

I have only read the first two books.

Can you answer a question. In the beginning of "The Great Hunt", the very first chapter is a prologue. Who is the character Bors? I thought maybe he was the Whitecloak but then that didn't seem to fit since he died before he could do much evil at Toman head.

Any theories? I wasn't really clear what the Whitecloaks were doing in this book.

Also, who let Fain out of his cell? Was it Ingtar?

[Squilo]

well, to tell you would be sort of a spoiler. so just RAFO! and enjoy the story!


Squilo Sedai

[sedk]

I think Fain turned into Mashadar and jumped throuh the wall..
But who is the Tinker and Tairen HighLord dark friend??
I don't think RJ just put them there for the fun of it, so it might be importain.
I am going to get a sticker that says Whitecloaks suck

[ogierbear]

OK, now I'm confused. What does RAFO stand for?

[WolfGaidin]

RAFO is what Robert Jordan most oftens answers when people ask spoilercontaining questions. It stands for:

Read And Find Out[/i][/color]

[Squilo]

ok the tinker one is SO OBVIOUS!!! its



spoiler



aram! what kinda tinker do u see that just goes and picks up swords and gets suddenly good with them. the tairen lord, well i think either weiramon or dobraine. probably not dobraine because he nearly gets assasinated. or maybe it is him because the DO doesnt want him to talk. as for weiramon, i just dont like him so hes a darkfriend.

[sedk]

Why in the world would it be sooo OBVIOUS!!! that aram is a friend of the dark?
Maybe all the Aiel also is darkfriends because they picked up the spear?

[Isabel]

HI Ogierbear:
It is not really a secret who Bors is. I believe it is actually mentioned in book 2. And if it is not, you will find out in the next few books:)

bye Isabel

[HammerOfGod]

Let me just tell you that you got your Whitecloaks mixed up Bors didn't die at Falme... I don't want to spoil the books for you but that point of information will not hurt anything....

I assure you Bors is still around after tGH

Enjoy the books they just get better...

As far as who let Fain out of his cell, I don't know and I am on my 23rd time through the first 9 books, and 3rd time through CoT... I think that is another one of those little things that will be left until the end of the series....

[ogierbear]

23 times? Wow, I'm not sure I've seen any movie 23 times let alone read 9 books as good as they are. I suppose there are "Seinfeld" or Honeymooners" episodes I've seen 23 times.

[HammerOfGod]

I have all the audio books of WoT and I have a part time job of caretaker in two empty houses... It is boring... I listen to 6 hours of the books every day....


I am listening to {Winter's Heart} where Faile is being healed.....

[Isabel]

SPOILERS!!

I think Lanfear freed Fain. Oh with spoilers to book 3, i believe.

Lanfear freed Fain.

I think it was Lanfear who freed Fain in Fal Dara.

--------------------------------------------------------------
The door to the outer guardroom opened, spilling in a flood of light, darkly outlining a figure in the doorway.
Fain stood. "You! Not who I expected." He stretched with a casualness he did not feel. Blood raced through
his veins; he thought he could leap over the keep if he tried. "Surprises for everyone, eh? Well, come on. The
night's getting old, and I want to sleep sometime."
(TGH, The Shadow in Shienar, page 68)
--------------------------------------------------------------

So it was someone Fain didn't expect. So we can rule out Trollocs or Myrdraal. Although there
were Trollocs with the one who freed Fain.
I also don't think it was our darkfriend Ingtar. He said that he let in the Gray Man.

--------------------------------------------------------------
"I never knew what he was going to do," Ingtar said softly, as if talking to himself. He had his sword
out, testing the edge with his thumb. "A pale little man you didn't seem to really notice even when you were
looking at him. Take him inside Fal Dara, I was told, inside the fortress. I did not want to, but I had to do it.
You understand? I had to. I never knew what he intended until he shot that arrow. I still don't know if it was
meant for the Amyrlin, or for you."
(TGH, Ingtar, To come out of the shadow, page 552)
--------------------------------------------------------------

I think he would have confessed otherwise. He was going to die. And would Fain be afraid of
just a darkfriend? I don't think so.
The person who freed Fain also should be someone who could channel. Because Mat and Egwene
didn't have a mark on them.

--------------------------------------------------------------
His light finally reached the end of the cells. The door to Fain's cell stood open, and the cell was empty, but it was the
two shapes infront of the cell that made Rand leap forward and drop to his knees between them.
Egwene and Mat lay sprawled bonelessly, unconscious...or dead. With a flood of relief he saw their chests
rise and fall. There did not seem to be a mark on either of them.
(Tgh, Dark Prophecy, page 79)
--------------------------------------------------------------
"She is not badly hurt,"Moiraine said after a moment. "She was struck here." She traced an area on the side of Egwene's
head, covered by her hair; Rand could see nothing different about it. "That is the only injury she has taken.
She will be all right."
(TGH, Dark prophecy, page 80)
--------------------------------------------------------------

The person who freed Fain would also be someone who could control Trollocs. Because there were
Trollocs who ate the guards and if Trollocs are let loose they also would have eaten Mat and Egwene.

--------------------------------------------------------------
His eyes fell on the table, and he stopped dead, breath and even thought freezing. On either side of the still burning
lamp, as if to make a centerpiece sat the heads of the guards in two pools of blood.
...
Slowly he became aware of the rest of the room, only half seen and not taken in during his hasty search for an attacker.
Bloody lumps of flesh lay scattered through the straw. There was nothing he could recognize as human except the two heads.
Some of the pieces looked chewed.
(TGH, Dark Prophecy, page 77)
--------------------------------------------------------------

And also the person who freed Fain would also be very quick, because Mat also didn't remember anything.

--------------------------------------------------------------
"Don't you remember, Mat?" "Remember?" Mat sleepily raised a hand toward his face,
then let it fall again with a sigh. His eyes began to drift shut. "Remember Egwene. Asked me..go down... see Fain."
He laughed, and it turned into a yawn. "She didn't ask. Told me.... Don't know what happened after..."
(TGH, Blood calls Blood, page 95)
--------------------------------------------------------------

So I think it must be a Forsaken who freed Fain. Partly I think it is lanfear because she can drive people mad.

--------------------------------------------------------------
While never a field commander, Lanfear was very useful to the Dark One both before and during the War of
the Shadow. Using dreams, she guided a number of operations that turned people against established authority,
creating massive riots.She is credited with winning several battles for the Shadow by the same means. She is credited with
driving a number of people mad and driving others to suicide, as well as performing outright assassinations
in Tel'aran'rhiod.
(BWB, about Lanfear, page 63)
--------------------------------------------------------------

And the other prisoners were crazy.

--------------------------------------------------------------
The prisoner in the fancy coat was sagging against the iron grille of his cells, his belt looped around the bars and then around his neck.
As Rand looked, he gave one last kick, scraping across the straw-covered floor, and was still, tongue and eyes bulging out of
a face gone almost black. His knees almost touched the floor; he could have stood anytime he wanted to.
Shivering, Rand peered into the next cell. The big man with the sunken knuckles huddled in the back of his cell, eyes
as wide as they could open. At the sight of Rand, he screamed and twisted around, clawing frantically at the stone wall.
(TGH, Dark prophecy, page 79)
--------------------------------------------------------------

Another point why I think Lanfear freed Fain is because she is mentioned in the Dark Prophecies written on
the walls of Fal Dara.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Daughter of the Night, she walks again.
The ancient war, she yet fights.
Her new lover she seeks, who shall serve her and die, yet serve still.
Who shall stand against her coming?
The Shining Walls shall kneel.
Blood feeds blood.
Blood calls blood.
Blood is, and blood was, and blood shall ever be.
--------------------------------------------------------------

The points I mentioned were only extra arguments, but the main argument is this:
We knew that Lanfear loved Ltt and that she also wanted that Rand loved her.
So I think if I were free I would first check out the man I loved. And something suspicious happened
in Fal Dara with Rand.

--------------------------------------------------------------
His skin prickled, and he spun on his heels. No one there. Just the big square tool chests and the quenching barrels full
of oil. The hair on the back of his neck stirred, and he whipped round again.
The hammers and tongs hung in their places on the wall. Angrily he stared around the big room. There's nobody there. It's just my
imagination. That wind, and the Amyrlin; that's enough to make me imagine things.
Outsite in the armorer's yard, the wind swirled up around him momentarily. Despite himself he jumped, thinking
it meant to catch him. For a moment he smelled the faint odor of decay again, and heard someone behind him laughing
slyly. Just for a moment. Frightened, he edged in a circle, peering warily. The yard, paved with rough stone, was
empty except for him. Just you bloody imagination! He ran anyway, and behind him he thought he heard the laughter
again, the time without the wind.
(TGH, Rand, Friends and enemies, page 24)
--------------------------------------------------------------

So Lanfear has recognized Rand or knew it was Rand. What she now wanted is to have him alone, or
at least a little bit alone where not many people are and where she could try to force him to channel.
Than she learned that Liandrin tried to have him taken to the Tower. That wasn't in the interesed of Lanfear.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Pulling the door shut behind her, Liandrin suddenly felt a prickling across her skin Breath catching, she
whirled about, looking up and down the dimly lit hall. Empty. It was full night beyond arrowslits. The
hall was empty, yet she was sure there had been eyes on her. The vacant coridor, shadowy between the lamps on
the wall, mocked her. She shrugged uneasily, then started down the hall determinedly. Fancies take me.
Nothing more.
(TGH, the Shadow in Shienar, page 67)
--------------------------------------------------------------

So she freed Fain and took trollocs into fal dara, but didn't let them touch/ eat Mat and Egwene.

After this she simply followed Rand and his party out of Fal Dara.

--------------------------------------------------------------
"There's a woman at that window. How I bloody missed her..." He was running for the house before anyone else
could move.
....
"Gone, my Lord. But she was there. A woman in a white dress, at the window. I saw her. I even thought I saw
her inside, for a moment, but then she was gone, an..." He took a deep breath. "The house is empty, my Lord."
(TGH, Uno, The Hunt begins, page 148)
--------------------------------------------------------------
"All I'm bloody saying," he heard Uno tell Ragan as they dismounted, "is that I bloody saw her, burn you. Just
before we found the goat kissing Halfman. The same flaming woman as at the flaming ferry. She was there,
and then she bloody wasn't."
(TGH, Glimmers of the Pattern, page 159)
--------------------------------------------------------------

I think these two quotes are also important, because no Forsaken would just Travel to villages in
the middle of nowhere to find Rand. She would at least have known how he looked like and where they
were going and she would have keep track of them in TAR.
So this is why i think Lanfear freed Fain.

[HammerOfGod]

This is well thought our Isabel.....

thanks for giving us such a good analysis.... I have never seen this theory before... It does make sense... tGH was full of Lanfear so strengthens your case....

[Isabel]

;D thx:))